02x23 - Don't Bully Me

[bunniefuu]

The Defendant purchased this puppy
from you.

His daughter was playing with the puppy,
she fell in love with the dog.

He told me that he would pay $750.

Also, in our text messages, which you,
uh... Do you still have them?

- Are you a married guy?
- No, Your Honor.

You know how did I know that?
Because you talk a lot.

[narrator]
This is Judy Justice.

[theme music playing]

[narrator] Dog breeder, Kenneth Bearden,
is suing his customer, Zack Thompson,

for the balance of a puppy.

[bailiff]
Court, come to order. All rise.

Have a seat, please.

- Hello, Judge.
- How are you?

Case #2044, Bearden versus Thompson.

- [Judy] Mr. Bearden.
- Yes, Your Honor.

[Judy] It is your claim that
the Defendant owes you

the balance of a dog that you sold to him.

- Correct, Your Honor.
- That's what the case is about.

The Defendant says he doesn't really
think he got what he bargained for,

and while he has no intention
of returning the dog to you,

- he doesn't want to pay the balance.
- Yes.

[Judy] That'd be a yes. So,
I have a couple of questions,

'cause it's not a terribly difficult case.
You say in your complaint

that you are a breeder
of "full-blood tri-color Bullies."

Correct. The Bully breed...
American Bullies...

and these are tri-color American Bullies
which have five different distinctions

within the American Bully breed.

I don't want you to try to confuse me
anymore than I'm confused about this.

Yes, ma'am.

Is an American Bully a pit bull?

- No, I have proof of...
- Ssh!

- It is not.
- It is not.

What is it a combination of?

Yes, it is a combination of.

Well, I know it's a combination of,
but it's been recognized by

the American Kennel Club
as an independent breed of dog.

But that is only recently.

What is the American Bully
a combination of?

Honestly, um, this is...
Can I read what I have?

No. If you say I don't... Listen to me.

I know it's very, very hard for men
to say three words: I don't know.

- [all laugh]
- Somehow they can say, "I love you,"

"I hate you," "Get out of my parking
space," "You're snoring."

They can say a whole bunch of things,

but they have trouble saying
those three words.

Yes, ma'am.

I... don't... know.

I fully own that, yes, ma'am.

- I... don't know.
- I don't know.

- Perfect. Sarah, look it up.
- [laughs]

- Will do.
- American Bully.

It says that originally, standardized and
recognized as a breed in 2004

by the American Bully Kennel Club. Mm-hmm.
- [Judy] 2004.

So, if it's recognized a breed in 2004,
it's gotta be a mix of something.

So, the American Bully was started by
crossing the American Pit Bull Terrier

with other dogs in the Bully breed family,

and sometimes dogs
outside of the Bully breed family.

But it's become its own breed.

It's become its own breed,
but started with the American Pit Bull.

That's what that says.
Do you want her to read it again?

So, there's also, Bully dogs
are descendants from the crosses

between ancient bull dogs and
a variety of British Terriers.

And this says an American Bully
was started by the crossing

of the American Pit Bull Terrier with
dogs in the other Bully breed family.

And ultimately, it was recognized
as a breed unto itself,

although, I don't understand
how that could happen

if you're a cross between one breed,
the American Pit Bull

and a variety of other dogs.
You know, that's like a Golden Doodle.

That's like a Golden Retriever
and a poodle.

Isn't that what a Golden Doodle is?

I believe so.

But it's not a breed unto itself.
It's a cross between a couple of dogs,

so it takes many years.
And this sounds to me, at least,

Mr. Bearden... as the Bullies
that you're describing that you breed...

the genesis of that breed
is an American Pit Bull

with a variety of other things.
Could be a Boxer...

It could also, like the father,
it could be a Rottweiler.

Like the father of the puppies
that he got,

he has all the markings of a Rottweiler,
but he has the head shape

and body stout that represents
more of the pit bull style.

So, that's information that I am now,
at least a little, armed with.

So now, I'm gonna come back to you,
you're the breeder.

And you said the puppies...
that the litter you sold to him...

one of the puppies has Rottweiler in it.

No, I'm not saying that it has Rottweiler.
I'm saying that

the physical representation of it,
the markings, the brown over the eyes,

the brown here...
That's what the dad looks like.

- The puppies don't look like that.
- Just a second.

- So, you bred the dogs.
- Mm-hmm.

What breed is the father?

The father is American Bully. He's
considered an XL American Bully.

- The father is an American Bully.
- [Kenneth] Mm-hmm.

In the father's history, it appears,
based upon the look of the dog,

- this is what I'm understanding...
- [Kenneth] Yes.

It's a Rottweiler.
In the history of the dog.

Yeah, it could possibly, yes.
That's why he looks like that now, yes.

It could possibly be a gerbil, but a
gerbil doesn't have distinctive markings.

What you're telling me is the dog has
the distinctive markings of a Rottweiler

- but the body of a Pit Bull.
- Yes, Your Honor.

Oh, what a combo!

He's beautiful. He's a beautiful dog.

They're beautiful dogs.
Both of those dogs, by the way,

will not be covered
by most insurance policies.

Pit Bulls and Rottweilers.
You do know that.

- Yes.
- [Judy] Say yes loud!

- So we can hear you. Okay.
- Yes, I know that, yes.

- Did you know that?
- I did not.

[Judy] Well, it's interesting.
Do you own your own home?

- Yeah. Yes.
- [Judy] Yes, is an answer.

- Do you have homeowner's insurance?
- Yes.

In your application for homeowner's
insurance, they would ask you

what kind of dog you have,
if you have any. Do you remember that?

Yes.

Did you write down what kind of a dog
you had?

I didn't have a dog at the time.

I want you to read over your
homeowner's policy, wherever you live.

Who are you covered by?

I'm not exactly sure.

You're not certain?

You don't know who your homeowner's policy
is with?

It's all in the bill. It's all paid for,
one... one yearly fee.

- You mean, for your car, for your home...
- Yes.

...everything else? I would check, sir,
if you own your own home.

Did you have a lot invested in your home?

- Yes.
- I would take a look.

Because many insurance companies now

will not insure,
or charge an extra premium

if they would insure, homes that have,
as part of their household,

- certain breeds of dogs.
- Hmm.

I am telling you, and he knows it,
that Pit Bulls and Rottweilers

- are in that group.
- Yep.

So, if something happens
and your dog bites somebody

and they will sue you and you'll say,
"well, I have homeowner's insurance,"

your policy might just disclaim.

That's why I didn't want a Pit Bull.

What do you think you got?

A Pit Bull. [chuckles]

[Judy chuckles] You got an American Bully.

And it's not so hard to look up...
You do have a tablet or something?

A Bully, when you look it up,
it actually is American Bulldog

and a Staffordshire Terrier.

Well, an American Bulldog
and a Staffordshire Terrier...

You know what a Staffordshire Terrier is?

- Yeah.
- [Judy] What is it?

Yeah, I mean, it's a Pit Bull.

Right! That's what it is.
Everybody tries to use different language

because they want to get away from that.
It's a Bully... It's a Terrier...

It's a something else... But bottom line,
that's what it is.

And you know that's what it is.
Whether it's a half or a quarter,

you know it's listed among those breeds

that the insurance company
is not gonna cover you for.

And you have knowledge of that.
You gotta be careful.

So, it was your understanding
that you were purchasing

from the Plaintiff a what?

A full, 100% Bully.

There's no 100% Bully.
There is no 100% Bully.

You just told me.
A Bully is a mix between a...

After so long, it's considered
a full... full Bully.

That's from my understanding.

That's not what that says.
It says, "among other things."

You really have to be more vigilant.

Don't tell me what your friends told you.
don't tell me what they did.

Don't tell me what they said.

He told you that he was selling you
an American Bully.

[theme music playing]

[narrator] Dog breeder, Kenneth Bearden,
claims his customer, Zack Thompson,

owes for the balance of a puppy.
Zack says he did not receive

the full-blooded American Bully
he purchased.

Okay. Tell me when
and under what circumstances

Mr. Thompson purchased
this puppy from you.

Yes, Your Honor. On April 28th
the Defendant reached out to me.

He just... He was stating his name...

- Ssh.
- [Kenneth] Sorry.

He stated his name and that, uh,
his daughter was playing with a puppy

of a friend of his, and that friend of his

had bought one of the puppies
from my litter.

She fell in love with the dog.
She loved it.

He wanted to come by
and possibly get another puppy.

How old's your daughter?

Seven.

If I could do that thing that some people
do, you know, cross their eyes on purpose,

I would do that for you.
Is this your only child?

Yes.

After he reached out to me,
we exchanged numbers

and spoke for a few days
over Facebook Messenger.

I gave him my number.
We had a conversation on the phone

about prices, about the breed,
and payments,

because he reached out to me originally
stating that,

"hey, I don't have that full amount
that you would be asking for."

Just a second. Could I see text messages
where you discussed the price?

- Yes, ma'am.
- And where you agreed on a price.

Uh, no, that was...
So, we agreed on a price verbally.

The text messages is where
I sent him my number.

Right after I sent him my number,
that's when we had the conversation

about prices and payments.

- Let me see what you...
- Yes, ma'am.

Do you want text messages
and the Facebook messages?

- [Judy] Yeah.
- Okay.

It's quite a bit. It's all in order,
from front to back.

Oh, no-no-no-no-no. Just about
the price of the dog, please.

Well, like I said, Your Honor,
the price of the dog

- was a verbal conversation.
- I understand that.

The initial discussion
that you had with him,

you told him what you wanted for the dog.

Yes. Thank you, sir.

Mr. Thompson, you wrote,
"I told him I would even take the runt

if you're willing to help me
get a puppy for my daughter."

- Yes.
- [Judy] Right.

Okay. How old was the puppy

when the puppy was delivered
to Mr. Thompson?

They were right at two months
and two weeks, I believe.

So, about ten weeks old.

Yeah, they were born February 20th.
This was May 1st when they were...

[Judy] Do you have a contract
with him other than over the phone?

When he came there that morning...

- [Judy] That's either a yes or a no.
- No. No.

You do not have a written contract?

The only contract that we have is of him
giving me his I.D.,

letting me take a picture of it because
I didn't have any printer ink at the time.

- You don't have a contract with him.
- [Kenneth] No.

- Are you a married guy?
- No, Your Honor.

You know how did I know that?
Because you talk a lot.

Most married guys don't talk so much.
[laughing]

They answer two or three words
and that's it.

Do you live alone?

Yes, it's just me and my son.

- How old is your son?
- [Kenneth] He's 12.

How many of these dogs
do you have roaming around?

I have two.

Okay. Mr. Thompson, the Plaintiff
delivered the dog to you.

You had no written contract with him.
You just agreed to take the dog

- at a certain price. Correct?
- Correct.

He agreed to sell you the dog, and you
discussed he got this much with papers,

this much without, but he was willing
to work with you without papers. Correct?

Yes, correct.

So, you were getting a dog without
AKC papers for how much?

- $500.
- [Judy] $500.

- [Zack] A hundred dollars down.
- Just a second. What?

A hundred dollars down and then
a hundred dollars every two weeks,

until it was paid off.

- So, you gave him the hundred dollars.
- [Zack] Yes.

And then you never paid him anymore.

Well, before the next payment
was even there,

I questioned him about being a full Bully.
'Cause everybody kept telling me

it wasn't a full Bully.
I have multiple friends that...

Don't tell me what your friends told you.
Don't tell me what they did.

Don't tell me what they said.

He told you that he was selling you
an American Bully.

- Yeah. Yes.
- Without papers.

So that you weren't going to use this dog
for any breeding purposes.

- Yes, didn't plan to.
- Because you don't have papers.

That would be sort of foolish for you.

Yeah.

Did your daughter
fall in love with the dog?

- Got the dog that she wanted, right?
- Yes.

- A little female called...
- Zoe.

- [Judy] Zoe.
- Yeah, she picked her out.

- Your Honor, I disagree with that also.
- What?

When he originally arrived that morning,
he was trying to get a different dog.

- He wanted a certain one.
- No, just a second.

- Your daughter picked this dog out.
- Yeah.

You disagree with that?

The daughter and him both wanted
a different dog at first.

We had our minds set on a certain puppy
before we got there.

When we showed up, the puppy that
we wanted was getting taken by another...

- So, your daughter picked another puppy.
- [Zack] Yes, yes.

Let's not make this harder than it is.

She picked the one
that she was happy with.

- And she's still happy with it.
- Yep.

- And she likes it.
- [Zack] Yes.

- You wouldn't take it away from her.
- No, I would not.

You wouldn't give it back to him.

- No, I would not.
- [Judy] Then you have to pay for it.

- I would've...
- [Judy] What is so hard about that?

Well, he lied about the shots,
proof of the first shots.

Just a second. You have a contract.

That's, if you're going to pay,
he says $750, you say $500.

Whether it's $750 or $500,
what you're supposed to have

if you're a breeder
is a written contract.

- Yes.
- [Judy] That's what you do.

You have a written contract.
I always have a contract

when I buy puppies. The breeders,
reputable breeders demand it.

They say that they guarantee the health
of the puppy for a certain period of time.

You can take the dog to have it checked
by a vet within a certain period of time.

It says whether the puppy
had its first shots or second shots,

or had no shots. It says all that.
That's it.

Other than that, I don't remember
what these contracts said,

but I've bought many and they're all
pretty much standard.

You bought a dog for either $750 or $500
that you didn't pay for.

And now, you have a bunch of excuses.
Did you take the dog to a vet...

- Yes.
- ...and have the dog tested...

- ...as to its heritage?
- I have not.

Well, then you can't tell me
what your friends said to you.

Whether your friends said that looks like,
it doesn't look like,

I don't know what it looks like,
but they're not relevant.

If he's saying to you,
this is an American Bully,

and you've had the dog
professionally tested...

the DNA of that dog tested...
and it turns out

that it's a cacophony of things,
which clearly it is,

because it's a mix of things.
But you have to pay for the dog.

You ate the steak.
You don't wanna give it back.

The only question is how much did you
make an arrangement to pay?

- You say it was $750.
- Yes, Your Honor.

[Judy]
Do you have any paperwork to show that?

I do not, Your Honor.
Like I said, when he left,

I had them contracts out.
I didn't have any more printer ink.

He had to leave and be somewhere else.

That's when I asked to go ahead
and take a picture of his I.D.,

and I planned to get the contract
at a later date.

- Mr. Thompson.
- Yes?

Was he originally asking for $1,000
for the dog?

He never originally asked me for $1,000.

[Judy] No, but is that what your friend
paid for his dog?

I don't know what my friend
paid for the dog.

But I know that he was
having trouble selling him,

so he marked down the price.
I have a Facebook post

where he actually, on his own Facebook,
before I even...

Oh, do you have what...

I don't have it printed out.
I have it on my phone.

Oh, yeah, I'd like to see it.
Does it list a price on it?

It still has the price. It talks about
where he's willing to sell him

and work with people on deals,
'cause he couldn't sell him.

This is before I even met the guy.

Okay, well, so, do you acknowledge
that you posted that, sir?

That you were willing
to make deals with people

because you were having difficulty
getting rid of the puppies?

You're gonna pay him the balance of $400
now, 'cause you have the dog.

Do you understand?
A Bully isn't a full-bred dog.

A Bully has a lot of other things in it.
Do you understand?

[theme music playing

[narrator] Dog breeder, Kenneth Bearden,
is accusing his customer, Zack Thompson,

of refusing to pay the balance
on an American Bully puppy.

Zack says he didn't receive
the pure-bred he was promised

and tried to return the dog.

Do you acknowledge that
you posted that, sir?

That you were willing to
make deals with people

because you were having difficulty
getting rid of the puppies?

- No, Your Honor.
- [Judy] Okay, I'd like to see his...

- Make it a little brighter...
- [Judy] Because you say here

that you usually sell them
$2,000 with papers and $1,000 without.

- Yes. My Facebook...
- Okay. Just a second.

- Just a second.
- Oh. Yes, Your Honor.

[Judy] "Five pups left and
needing good homes.

These are full blooded American Tricolor
Bullies.

Please help us find them homes.
I'm willing to negotiate

and re-discuss price, payment.
At any point..."

Okay, so, you're willing to work
with anybody.

- Exactly.
- [Judy] Okay.

So, when you had a conversation with him,
tell me what price you arrived at.

We arrived at $750, and when we spoke,

he told me that he would
give me $100 every week.

And also, in our text messages,
it also states

where he mentions if his taxes came,
he would pay me in full.

Okay, but you talked about
pay $100 every week?

[Kenneth]
Yes. Yes, Your Honor.

In my messages, there's a few times
where I reference $500,

and he never says, well, it's $750,
not $500.

Okay, can I see those?
I'd like to see them.

- In that message...
- [Judy] Ju-Ju-Ju...

- [Zack] We also talked...
- Ssh, ssh, ssh.

- Just give me the message.
- [Zack] Okay.

Here's the one that states $500,
right here.

Yeah, I believe that the price
you negotiated was $500.

Because the only one of the litigants that
has any messages that has any number in it

is the Defendant, who talks,
at least on two occasions,

of the fact that he doesn't want to
pay $500 for a mixed-breed dog.

And there's nothing in there that says,
sir, it wasn't $500,

it was $750. You gave me $100,
so you still owe me $650.

That's what the response should have been,
and you didn't do that, sir. So...

I woulda had no problem paying him
the $500 if it was a full Bully.

No problem at all.

You're gonna pay him the balance of $400
now, 'cause you have the dog.

- Okay.
- [Judy] Do you understand?

A Bully isn't a full-bred dog.
A Bully has a lot of other things in it.

Do you understand?
And you want to keep the dog?

No, I wanted to bring the dog back.
He said I could bring the dog back,

and then he wrote back and said
I could bring it back.

I just asked you a question. You want me
to have her read it back to me?

I don't want to bring the dog back now.

Well, now is what we're talking about.
Now is where we are.

It's four or five months now,
my daughter's fell in love.

But the first ten days, I did ask
to bring it back. He said okay.

Right now we're not in the first ten days.
Right now, we're here.

I asked you a question.
Do you want to give him the dog back?

If that's what it takes, yes.

- You ready to take the dog back?
- I do not want to.

Once we sold the animal, like, once...

Well, if he says that there is no proof

that this litter was
a full-blooded American Bully.

And you have the American Kennel Club
records that show that it is.

Because you must have
registered the litter.

That's what happens, Mr. Bearden,
when you have a full-blooded dog.

You register the litter and then,
if you're selling it with papers,

the new owner will register the dog
with the AKC in their name.

So, all you have to do now is show me
the registration for that litter.

- Your Honor...
- No, no, that's either a show me,

- or I don't have it.
- I do not have that, Your Honor.

Because there was no reason. That's why
the puppies were $2,000 with papers

and $1,000 without.
There's no reason going the extra mile.

That's why they have the $2,000 option
of me taking that headache off their...

No, no, no, that's a lot of...
That's a lot of who shot John, sir.

If you are a breeder,
that's what you identify yourself as.

- I am a breeder of...
- Yes, Your Honor.

Okay? And clearly you are a breeder,
because he saw puppies

from another litter of yours
which drove him and his daughter

- to contact you.
- Yes, Your Honor.

So, if you're a breeder,
you register that litter

so that if you want to sell it,
a puppy with papers,

you've already registered that litter.
Either you can use it or not.

Do you understand... You would know
exactly what I'm saying.

Yes, that's the normal process
of things, yes.

And right now, Mr. Thompson,
at this point, I agree

that you agreed to pay $500 for the dog
and gave him $100 deposit.

Yes.

Which means you owe him $400.

He said I could bring the dog back,
at one point,

if I wanted to bring the dog back because
I didn't think it was the dog I wanted.

I'm talking about now.

Yes, I know, but, and then...

- [Judy] Then he said no.
- Then he said no two days later.

Then he said he's gonna take me
to court, or he threatened me

and said he was gonna send someone
to come get the money out of me if not.

That's when I stopped responding.

After he threatened me,
I stopped responding to him.

That was before our first initial payment.
That was within the first ten days.

And it wasn't even 14 days yet
when I was gonna make my payment.

Did you pay him $100?

I paid him $100, yes.

- [Judy] Yes, I'm talking about $100.
- Yes, I did.

So, what do you want me to do today?

I don't think he deserves nothing.
He lied about the breed.

- [Judy] No!
- He never sent me shots.

He lied about those,
and then he threatened me.

Do you want to return the dog to him,
or do you want to pay him the $400?

I'll return the dog to him.

Fine. He's returning the dog to you.
You understand?

- I paid all the vet bills.
- [Judy] I don't care.

But I will prepare an order that
within five days of today,

you will deliver the dog...
He delivered the dog to you?

No. I went to his house and picked it up.

- You went to his house? Great.
- [Zack] Yes.

How far do you live from each other?

Thirty minutes, probably.

Is there a police precinct in the middle?

Because I don't want this done
at anybody's house.

What police precinct
is closest to you, sir?

It'd be Bullitt County Police Department.

That's where you will meet
five days from today.

What's a good time for you?

Four p.m., five p.m.

What's a good time for you?

- Whenever...
- [Judy] Four o'clock.

- Yeah. Yes, Your Honor.
- [Judy] Four o'clock. Fine.

We'll prepare an order, give it to you,
you meet at the precinct,

and exchange the dog.

Will he pay me what I paid him?

He'll give you back the $100.

- What about all the vet bills?
- [Judy] That you eat.

- [Zack] Okay.
- Got it?

- Yes, Your Honor.
- That's the order. That's what he wants.

- [Zack] Sounds good.
- Let him go explain it to his daughter.

- Perfect. Thank you.
- All right.

- Let him win.
- [bailiff] This court is adjourned.

Yeah, I don't know what exactly
I'm gonna do moving forward.

I didn't feel like I got the dog
that I wanted.

I never made a threat to him,
never did anything like that.

I told him that I would take him to court.

There's definitely a better dog out there.

I'm a honest, hard-working man and
I deserve what he's supposed to pay to me.

So, I was so confused because
as I'm looking for where it comes from,

because I know it's not a pure-bred,
it said the American Bully

is a great family dog, because,
although bred from Pit Bulls,

which sometimes have
an aggressive tendency,

the aggressive tendencies of
American Bullies have been "bred out."

And I was a little bit confused how
you could breed out the aggression.

I don't know. I'd hate to be that guy
going home today

to explain to his seven-year-old
that she's losing her puppy.

Yeah, I'm glad I don't have to
go home to that.

[narrator] Have you been cheated?


[theme music playing]