02x102 - Mother and Son Fallout and Crypto Controversy

[bunniefuu]

You sold your son a car,
and he didn't pay you.

I don't wanna see him hurting,

but you still have to pay me for my car.

You could shake your head, no.
That's true.

You've seem to have a very fine
relationship with your son.

Odd to bring it to a lawsuit.

[narrator] This is Judy Justice.

Holly Kelm claims her son

and his wife Jacoby and Kelly Kelm,

owe for the cost of a van
and lost property.

[Bailiff] All rise.

Have a seat please.

Hello, Judge. Case 2127. Kelm versus Kelm.

-Thank you.
-You're welcome.

[Judge Judy] Mrs. Kelm,
this is your son? And your wife?

Yes.

[Judge Judy] What's your first name?

-Jacoby.
-[Judge Judy] What do they call you?

Jake.

How old are you, Jake?

Thirty one.

[Judge Judy]
How long have you been married?

Seven years.

[Judge Judy] Prior to getting married,

were you married to someone else?

Yes.

[Judge Judy] For how long?

Five years.

[Judge Judy]
Did you ever live with your mother?

No.

When was the last time
you lived with your mother?

I was 17, I believe.

OK. So you had a reasonable
relationship with your mother?

-Yes.
-[Judge Judy] Until when?

[Jake] Until May of, well,
I'd say September of this year.

[Judge Judy] September of 2022?

Correct.

This is about a car.

It's your claim that you sold your son
a car and he didn't pay you?

His defense is that it was a gift.

There was never
a discussion about payment.

When you turned over the car to your son,
according to what I've read,

you signed over the documents
that allowed him

to register the car in his own name,
which he did.

So he registered the car in his own name.

Is the car still driving now?

-No, it is not.
-[Judge Judy] Where is it?

Uh, it got scrapped.

[Judge Judy] When?

October 3rd, 2022,

which I have the receipt for that as well.

[Judge Judy] When did your mother
turn the car over to you?

May 31st.

[Judge Judy] What kind of car was it?

Uh, 2006 Chrysler Town and Country.

What happened to it?

Transmission went out on it, and,
uh, it had some electrical issues.

It kept draining the battery.

Had you spent anything
to have those issues addressed?

Not on the transmission.

I did replace the battery three times.

-Did you buy a new car?
-Yes.

-[Judge Judy] How much?
-$700.

-[Judge Judy] What kind of car?
-Uh, 2003 Nissan Altima.

[Judge Judy] Why don't you tell me
the circumstances, Jake,

of the transfer of the car

from your mother to you?

Tell me the date that that happened.

I got the title on the 30th of...

-Of May.
-[Jake] May.

On the 31st I was able to transfer it.

Tell me about the
conversation with your mother

when she signed over the title to you.

She says you were supposed to pay her
some $800 for the car.

No, Your Honor.

I want you to tell me what
the conversation was with your mother

when she gave you the title.

You came to her, you didn't have a car.

[Jake] Right.

You didn't have a car, you needed a car.

-And?
-She said,

"You know, the van's sitting
over at the other property.

It's just been sitting
there for the last year.

You can go over and if it starts
you can use it." And it did.

She said, "However,
you cannot take the van until

the title's transferred."

And at which point she gave me the title
and the lien card for it.

I went to the DMV, I transferred it,

came back, got the van,
and I was on my way.

About a month, month and a half later,
she was saying that if you give me $500,

I'll put it in the safe for you

and then I'll just give it
to you when you need it.

You have any communication
with your mother about the car?

Not anymore.

[Judge Judy]
I mean communication in writing.

Oh yes, I...I do.

But nothing about payments.

I mean, there was a few texts
here and there saying,

"I want my money
or I'll take the van back."

I'd like to see that.

OK.

I, yeah...I gotta,
I may have one more in here.

There is this one as well.

Jake, on September 3rd, Jake, you said,

"Not sure what's going on with you,

but this is getting ridiculous.
I'll pay you when I have the money."

Right.

-[Judge Judy] That's what you said?
-Yep.

I'm not saying I don't owe her anything.
I'm just saying I...

I was gonna give her
something just to show.

No, no, no.

So on September 3rd,
you got the car at the end of May.

So June, July, and August,
you had the car and you said,

"I'm not sure what's going on with you."

Maybe mom, you're having issues
that I don't know about, but,

"This is getting ridiculous.
I'll pay you when I have the money."

That's an acknowledgement
that you owe your mother the money.

-Correct.
-[Judge Judy] OK.

And how much did you agree
to sell him the car for?

-Car was $800.
-[Judge Judy] OK.

Tell me about discussing with him
the cost of the car

and what you were going
to sell it to him for.

We were at my friend's house
and we were playing marbles

and having a few beers like we always do.
We get together a lot.

And he didn't have a vehicle,

so we discussed he could use mine
and at that time he said,

"Well, he'd rather buy it."

And then I said,
"OK, I will sell the van."

Which I was talking to my daughter about
she wanted to buy it also.

And I told them both it was $800.

And you could shake your head, no,
that's true.

-Shh!
-[bangs gavel]

[Holly] But it was $800.

And he said,
OK, could he get it right away?

And I said, "Well, first of all,

I can't let you drive it
because you're not insured."

And then we talked about
he was gonna buy it and he would take it.

I said,
"You gotta transfer the title first."

So he did all that.

OK, well that's responsible
of both of you.

Yeah. There's no way we could leave
it go with no insurance.

So then they took the van, and I told
him first I need to clean it out

'cause I have a bunch of stuff in there.

They said they would clean it out,
but they needed a vehicle right away.

And I said, "OK." Um, I never...

When was the first time
you asked him for money?

$800 is a substantial amount of money.

He would get a paycheck
and he would go and go to the casino

or go to the racetrack or whatever.

And I said,
"Well what about paying me some money?"

[narrator] And later today...

You sound like a really bright young man.

I appreciate that, Your Honor.

You really should find
something important to do.

I have changed. I have changed
sectors since then, Your Honor.

[all laugh]

[narrator] Holly Kelm claims
her son and his wife

Jacoby and Kelly Kelm,

owe for the cost of a van
and lost property.

OK. When was the first
time you asked him for money?

In the summer sometime.

I mean we...we'd get together
at my friend's house

and it was probably...probably
a month later, I asked him,

"Are you gonna pay something on the van?"

I couldn't even say an exact date
because like I said, we got together,

we played cards and we would have a few
beers with my friends over at her place.

And then we discussed the van
a little bit.

Discussed the money.

Just for my own curiosity,

you've seemed to have up until this point,

a very fine relationship
with your son and his wife

Is this something
that interfered with that?

I mean, $800 is a substantial
amount of money,

but odd to bring it to a lawsuit.

There is really nothing
that interfered with our relationship

except for him not paying me some money.

And in between this time
and you...you both know this...

-Don't. Look at me.
-[Holly] There's one text in here.

"Do you have any money I could borrow?"

And well, I didn't have any money
and I think I probably had $20.

and I would give it to him
because being a mom,

I don't wanna see him hurting.

But I told him,
you still have to pay me for my car.

OK.

And he acknowledges that he would
pay you for the car, "When I have it."

But he would get his...
He would get a paycheck

and he would go and go to the casino

or go to the racetrack or whatever.

And I said,
"Well what about paying me some money?"

I said, "Can you at least give me $25
so I can pay for my medicine?"

"I don't have it." "OK."

OK. Judgement for the Plaintiff
for the amount of $800.

We're finished.

[Bailiff] This court is adjourned.

Well, I'm glad at least I'll get
my money back for the... my van.

There's a lot of things that my mom
did say that we're very untrue.

I love him. I will always love him.
He's my baby.

You just don't sue family
over something so stupid.

You know, I'm really happy
that I finally learned how to text.

Yeah. And how useful text messages can be.

Because I, you know, I was late to
the game with all this electronic stuff.

Anyway, these text messages
have become so vital to adjudicating cases

because younger people
memorialize everything,

including what they have
for breakfast and lunch

and what, how they're feeling
and what they're doing,

in text messages.

But for the text message that he gave me,

which set up, "I owe you the money.
I'll pay you when I have it."

I think people,
especially younger generation,

think it's...it's a flippant,
"Oh, I'm gonna send this text really quick

-or I'm gonna send..."
-To somebody on the phone.

[Sarah] Exactly.
Like it's... like it's a conversation.

But they don't realize legal implications
of sending a text from your phone number,

admitting a debt,
even if that's not what you intended

at the time you sent the text,

now there's this altercation
and you bring it to court.

Right. And it's memorialized in a writing.

-[Sarah] Yeah.
-Coming from your phone.

-Gotta be careful with what you text.
-[Judge Judy] Yeah.

Case 2132, Eagle versus Ulrich.

All parties, please step forward.

[narrator] Tobias Eagle
is suing his former friend,

Joshua Ulrich, for cryptocurrency profits

and equipment.

Mr. Eagle,
you and Mr. Ulrich were friends.

You were traveling together for business.

What kind of business were you in
other than this cryptocurrency?

First off, we weren't friends initially.

We were, first, business partners

and we worked together
underneath my mentor through his company.

Your Boss?

-[Tobias] Yes.
-OK.

And what kind of business?

It was, um, teaching in
workforce development for,

I guess you could say, um,
people who needed skills

so they can be prepared for
engineering jobs.

OK. You worked at the same company?

-Yes.
-[Judge Judy] OK.

And when did you decide to go
into this business together?

Around January to February, 2021.

-This has to do with cryptocurrency?
-Yes.

[Judge Judy] OK.

This cryptocurrency business
that you went into together,

did you form a company or an LLC?

Yeah, I already had a company established.

I was doing it more as a recreation, but...

So the answer is you and the defendant
when you wanted to go together

into this business
did not form a separate company?

No.

[Judge Judy] So individually,

it is your claim that you spent
some $20,000 on equipment

for this new company?

Yes.

And you were supposed to share
whatever profits there were

in this new company and quite frankly,

I know nothing about cryptocurrency.

I am of the Charlie Monger School
of Cryptocurrency.

I think it's all about
the Emperor's new clothes.

And unless I can feel it,
touch it, taste it, smell it,

or bite on it, it doesn't exist.

So I want you to know
that's where I'm starting.

-[Tobias] Yes.
-[Judge Judy] OK.

So you are going to explain to me

what the business was

that you were doing with him
that involved buying $20,000

-worth of equipment...
-Mm-hmm.

...which you now say is in
his possession that you want back.

-Yes.
-Cryptocurrency!

OK. He mentioned that he knew how to,
um, mine cryptocurrency.

-[Judge Judy] OK.
-That's how we use it.

I understand that those are
the words that you use.

Where is the mine?

May I explain cryptocurrency
to you a little more too, Your Honor?

-Oh, I'd love to hear you.
-[Joshua] OK. Sorry. Um...

Mining is just a term for generating
profits from cryptocurrency.

There is no physical mine,
as you may already be aware.

-[bangs on table]
-[Joshua] Um, it's not like mining gold.

Yes. It's not like anything.
It's like the Emperors new clothes.

Yes, Ma'am.

-[Joshua] But essentially cryptocurrency...
-That's why it collapsed.

[Joshua] Yes.

Cryptocurrency mining is just...

-[Judge Judy] You know that it collapsed.
-Oh, yes, it collapsed.

-Everybody knows that it collapsed.
-[Joshua] Yes, Ma'am.

Charlie Monger predicted that
a long time ago.

Yes, Ma'am.

-But essentially...
-You know that?

-Yes I do.
-[Judge Judy] OK.

So what you were involved in
is a shill game of Emperor's new clothes,

which would've involved
all of your investors.

Who was it that created cryptocurrency,
the Winklevoss...

I don't know who created Crypto.

[Judge Judy] ...brothers?
I don't know. I'm not sure.

In any event, somebody had
a vivid imagination.

Yes, Ma'am. But all crypto is,

is we essentially use our
computer resources,

specifically a piece called
a graphics card

that is really good at solving equations.

We essentially solve equations for money.

That's really all mining is.

You solve equations for money.

-Yes ma'am.
-[Judge Judy] What equations?

I don't know the specific equations.

Essentially the equations are so complex

that when you solve them,
you're rewarded for your time

and the effort that
your computer put into it.

And that's where the revenue
or mining comes from.

We essentially validate
transactions the same way

you might wanna make sure
that a transaction on

your bank statement is legitimate.

And so we were paid for
validating these transactions.

You sound like a really bright young man.

I appreciate that, Your Honor.

You really should find
something important to do.

-I have changed.
-[all laugh]

I have changed sectors since then,
Your Honor.

[Judge Judy]
You have equipment that he paid for?

No, Your Honor,
I would actually like to...

Just a second. I'm just asking a question.
I thought maybe we could resolve this.

Show me what equipment you purchased, sir.

The receipts for it
and tell me where it is.

[Tobias] And so we're not here
specifically for

the GPUs that he claimed.

-The what?
-[Tobias] GPUs. Graphics.

-Uh, graphic cards. Graphic cards.
-[Judge Judy] Just a second.

Don't say anything to me, sir.

You have a counterclaim for equipment.

I have it for equipment
and cryptocurrency assets.

I'm not bothering with that.

OK, no worries, Your Honor.

Yeah, no worries.

[narrator] Tobias Eagle claims
his former friend, Joshua Ulrich,

owes for cryptocurrency profits
and equipment.

"I contributed $20,000 in equipment..."

Yes.

[Judge Judy]
...and by the first quarter of 2021,

I am suing the defendant, Joshua Ulrich,
for cryptocurrency profits

and return or value of equipment."

Yes.

I'm not concerned about
cryptocurrency profits.

'Cause I think cryptocurrency
is a whole lot of "Who Shot John?"

Mm-hmm.

And the only ones
that probably got skunked

were any investors that
you put into cryptocurrency.

Well, it still has value, so...

[Judge Judy] Well, you know something,

tell that to all
the people who lost billions

in the last two weeks.

Would you mind just showing me
the equipment that you purchased

-and receipts for it?
-Yes.

[Judge Judy]
I didn't ask you for anything.

Yes, Your Honor.

[Judge Judy] Equipment that you purchased.

Okey dokey.

And so for this equipment,
it was purchased through a auctioning site

and so they only have
a year delay and then, um,

that was the only information
I was able to receive from them.

[Judge Judy]
That's not helpful to me, sir.

That's not helpful to me at all. I can't...
what am I supposed to do with this?

That's just showing that I have proof
that I purchased the equipment.

Doesn't show me how much.

It wasn't how much I bought it for,

it was cause I plan on rebuying
the equipment

and so that's just proof that I bought
the equipment and that he has it.

That a workstation,
a Hewlett Packer server?

Yes. And I have a price break.

One small pallet of
miscellaneous battery backups.

Yes. And there were
specifically 12 of those.

-[Judge Judy] And two Dell towers?
-[Tobias] Yes.

Everything here are things
that you want back from him?

Yes.

[Judge Judy] You have nothing in
your house of these things?

Of those things? No.
Those are in his barn right now.

-OK. Do you have these things?
-No, Your Honor.

[Judge Judy] Did you ever have this
in your possession?

Yes. At one point I did have it
in my possession.

[Judge Judy] When?

I had it in my possession when
we were at a shared facility

that was in Rancho Cordova.

Now you're not in
a shared facility anymore?

Yes, Ma'am.
Since we were in a shared facility,

I have never had the equipment
in my possession.

Furthermore, the equipment
that he's talking about

has nothing to do with this case.
This case is primarily around the assets.

You have no idea how simple
I'm gonna make this, sir.

-Yes, Ma'am.
-He has receipts for certain equipment.

I have receipts for more equipment
and I have a very...

Just a second.
You have a counterclaim for equipment?

I have it for equipment
and cryptocurrency assets.

[Judge Judy] I'm not bothering with that.

OK, no worries, Your Honor.

Yeah, no worries.

-No assets.
-No problem, Your Honor.

[Judge Judy]
There are no cryptocurrency assets.

Where is the equipment that you claim

he has that belongs to you?

It's at...
Well, it was originally at his house

when we moved out of the facility,
I relocated all of it to his house.

I have an inventory ran on
the last day I was at his house

marked with the location, the equipment,
and a lot of details.

I would love to show it to, Your Honor,
if that's acceptable.

[Judge Judy] Just a second. Do you have?

On that list? No.

Do you have any equipment at your house?

Yes.

[Judge Judy]
What equipment do you have at your house?

The graphics cards
that he's talking about.

So you have the graphics cards?

[Tobias] Yes.

[Judge Judy] That belong to him?

No, they belong to me mostly.

-So I bought...
-What do you mean

that they belong to you mostly?

I bought most of the graphics cards.

He put in some money for

some equipment expenses

and for my estimates,
which I wish I could have asked him,

was around $3,000 that he, um,

put in and I put around $15,000.

How do you expect a court to dissect

this business mess that you've created?

I'm not here for the, um,
the GPUs or graphics cards.

That's why I completely
left them out cause I...

No, but he's... he has a counterclaim.

And that's fine he can present it.

-[Judge Judy] I understand that.
-Sorry.

How do you expect somebody to pick apart
this legal morass that you have

except to say that
all of the stuff should be sold.

Understood.

I don't have any value of
what you claim you spent for this,

-because there are no amounts on it.
-Yeah.

Well that's a problem.

[Joshua] I do have documentation,
Your Honor, of all of it.

And it's labeled who purchased it
and the amounts.

In addition, the second page here
has the totals that he was talking about.

And the documentation pages
are below that.

[Judge Judy] OK. Now...

Great.

There isn't a lot of very expensive stuff
that you paid for, Mr. Ulrich.

-There's not too much, no, Your Honor.
-[Judge Judy] No.

There isn't too much
expensive stuff here. Right?

[Joshua] I agree. Yes, Ma'am.

You know we have something for $24,
something for $15.

You paid for the little stuff.
He paid for the big stuff.

Two things, Your Honor,
that I would like to mention.

First of all, he did not
purchase $20,000 worth of assets.

This is a highly inflated number.
I can actually prove it.

-Just a second.
-[Joshua] Yeah, no worries.

Just a second.
I'm not awarding him any money.

Each of you will take back
the things that you bought.

You didn't have a formed company together.

It's not a company asset.
It belongs to each of you.

-You're not in business anymore.
-Yes.

So all I have to know is
what do you have at your house

and what do you have at yours?

He has everything,
including all the physical assets.

That's a lie.

The only thing that I have at my house,
Your Honor,

is, or it's actually on my computer,
technically stored in a digital wallet.

A digital wallet is the same thing
as a regular wallet.

This is just how we store cryptocurrency.

But I don't want to care about that.
I don't care about that.

All I'm talking about is equipment.

Oh. I have no equipment
at my house, Your Honor.

What equipment does he have in his house?

He has everything that's listed
on that document that I gave you.

And I actually do have proof
that he has it because...

I'd like to see it.

So these are text messages
from my roommate to his mother.

-[Judge Judy] From who?
-From my roommate.

He was supposed to be here as a witness.

If he's not here,
you can't show me texts from him.

He wasn't able to make it.

Well, I...you can't prove something
to me via hearsay

from a witness who's not here.

It's not hearsay,
it's just text messages that he gave...

That's hearsay by a person not here.

You know, I actually don't think that
you're ready to have this case tried.

-I believe...
-[Judge Judy] I can't help you.

You say you don't have
anything in your house.

You can't tell me how much the item cost.

If he said he doesn't have
anything in his house,

should I rule that
he has to give it back to you?

And he said, I don't have it.
I can fix a dollar amount,

but I can't do that unless
you have what you paid for.

I have documentation here that
at the value at which I have had to pay

to buy it back because since
it was through a auctioning site,

I don't remember. I had several auctions.

I bought most of that equipment from.

You can show me a bank statement
where you paid money to an auction house.

I just wanna see an amount
that you paid to the auction house.

-I don't have that on me apparently.
-[Judge Judy] OK.

-Well, Your Honor...
-The case is dismissed without prejudice.

Go back to the courts
where you originally came from

and see if they can help you
any more than I'm willing to.

Can't help you until you get
your documentation together, sir.

You're the Plaintiff in this case.

-I have...
-[Judge Judy] I cannot award...

You don't have anything if you don't have
what you paid for the equipment.

-But...
-[Judge Judy] He said he doesn't

-have the equipment.
-And he's lying.

It may be. And the proof
that you have is inadmissible here

because your friend who authored
those texts is not here.

And the case is dismissed
without prejudice.

Go back to the court where you started it.

Thank you.

[Bailiff] This court is adjourned.

[narrator] Want justice?