01x04 - The Escape

[bunniefuu]

First, I would like to make it very clear

that I'm not a danger

or a threat to society or anyone else.

I left in self-defense.

I have a genuine fear

for my personal safety.

And all I can do is wait until

the legal system works itself out,

I'm a victim of their politics.

In the dark side, I am waiting ♪

Even sane, I am waiting ♪

As a child, I remember ♪

Daddy, daddy, all alone ♪

Mr. Gorbachev

and the Prime Minister

appeared to get on well together.

Big smiles today.

Downrange distance,

seven nautical miles.

The nuclear disaster

in the heart of Soviet farmland

For Milligan, this change

in his treatment at the hospital

is a ploy to keep him institutionalized.

Billy Milligan's escape was

reported to the, uh, state highway patrol,

and then it was handled locally

through the local troopers

and I got involved, I think, the next day.

Milligan ran away on Friday,

he is now searched all over the state.

It was over a July 4th period of time

where there would be fewer staff.

And that Dr. Lindner

decided that he was going to

adjust Billy's medications'

back to the stuff

the psychotropics that were not good.

I mean, and he's under Dr. Lindner again.

The person who was

responsible for the Thorazine

and everything that happened in Lima.

I just thought he would be gone for,

you know, a couple days at the most.

Uh, there was

considerable media attention.

He had a lot of attorneys.

He had a lot of doctors.

In my gut, ever since

the beginning of time with this case,

I've I've sensed a tragic ending

and I hope my gut feelings are wrong.

And we have to get him back.

I have been informed

by his treating psychiatrist

that if and when that medication runs out,

he could fragment

and then become very dangerous.

No one needs to be afraid of Billy

because if any one

of these personalities are out,

you really have to know Billy

to detect the personalities.

They can be out,

but they're not dangerous.

I'm not concerned for public safety at all

because even

he's learned to deal with that before

in a few states and he's not violent,

but I am very concerned about himself

as far as getting very depressed,

maybe doing something to himself.

Being a friend of Billy Milligan

was always putting yourself

into a moral dilemma.

Not always, but many, many times I felt,

"Should I cross the state line or not?"

His escape was well-planned.

He had assistance from Mr. Murray.

He'd been in

communication with his attorneys,

with the State public defender.

Billy He was just going away

from the hospital for the weekend.

So my feeling was that

he was probably going

to go back on Monday or Tuesday.

You know, soon.

I suggested that he make a video

and I would record it

and have him explain

why he had left the hospital.

And that he had not escaped.

He did not hold anybody prisoner.

He just simply walked out,

which he always did.

It seems that my treatment,

that my commitment

and everything else to the institution

has become an issue of politics.

I don't think they really care

what is best for me or society

or the individual

at the institution at this point.

And then I called each of the news media

and told them that there

was a videotape from Billy Milligan

in locker number 28.

It seemed like

the Billy Milligan story would never end.

When interest started to die on him,

he would do some crazy thing

that would put him in the headlines again.

There is concern

that one of his 24 separate personalities

takes control of him.

And what if this personality

is not a peaceful person

but a violent one?

It came to a point

that I, also in addition to

being with Billy and protecting him,

I was in touch with people

who wanted to bring him back.

And Billy had two main lawyers.

One was Randy Dana

and his boss was Gary Schweickart,

but it had to be done in a way

that was satisfactory to everyone.

Billy wanted his treatment team

to have charge of his medications.

He wanted a judge to rule on that.

He had conditions he started setting up

as to when and why

he would choose to come back,

but that wasn't happening very quickly.

He called me

to let me know that he was okay

and that he just could not

take the pressure from the media

and the fighting of the doctors

and the discrepancies

in all the medications.

It was making him crazy.

And I don't know

who came up with this idea.

Probably maybe me.

I realized that, you know

it might be better if Billy

were outside the state right now.

So, the plan, I think

Originally, it was I rented a car

and we were going to

just drive outside of state

so that we were safer.

So, I thought, "Well, we could

drive towards Colorado

and at any point turn right back around

and be back in Ohio."

On the trip to Colorado,

Billy was in great shape.

He had no stress.

I just remember we had a really good time

driving through two or three states.

I left him in Aspen.

I flew back and left the car with him

and then he eventually

left it at the airport.

Once we found out that,

okay, there's a car in Denver

with his personal belongings,

then the FBI got involved

then that became a national issue.

Well, I had never heard of Billy Milligan

until he became a fugitive in 1986.

He would've been

considered armed and dangerous.

We also found out that he had a relative

in British Columbia in Canada.

The very next time

I heard my brother's voice

was July 16th, 1986.

He told me that he was doing well,

that he had been

brought out to Colorado by Jim.

He told me that he was

painting on the sidewalk.

He was making good money

and up to that point that day,

he'd made about $1,000

and was doing okay.

I asked him, "What are your plans?"

He said, "I don't have any plans."

He called me later that evening, the 16th,

and told me that he would

be on a plane that night

and he would be coming to Seattle

and I would see him

the morning of the 17th.

He was in good spirits. He seemed

This was the first time

I had seen him in years.

I mean years, literally.

We talked a little bit.

I said, "I can't take you

to British Columbia."

"But there's a town just

south of the border called Bellingham."

"You're going to love it.

It's just like Athens."

Next morning, I went down there,

we had breakfast, we talked about it.

He said, "I walked around town a little.

I like it here. It's really cute."

"I like it."

And that was the start of him

being in Bellingham.

We drove around until we found

a "For Rent" sign on a house,

a little house on a hill.

He went in, talked to the people inside.

He came back out said,

"I've got a place. It's rented."

I said, "Great."

He already had a new name.

"Christopher Carr." He told me about that.

I gave Billy Milligan

a social security number,

a card for Christopher Carr,

and then he used those to apparently get

either a driver's license

or some sort of state ID,

and then he took it from there.

So, he became Christopher Carr.

And I'm not sure

if the FBI knew at that point

that Chris Carr was Billy Milligan.

I started seeing my brother

on an every-couple-of-day basis,

at the very minimum.

Weekends and things like that.

He wanted to get out of Bellingham,

wanted to see some things.

So, I took the chance

and brought him to Canada.

I got him across the border.

We didn't have to lie.

They didn't ask who he was.

He stayed at my house,

wanted some artwork,

wanted to do some art.

So I went out and bought some art canvases

and art supplies, everything,

and he sat on the floor

and did some of

the greatest art I've ever seen.

Inside of an hour

he did an unbelievable art scene,

an unbelievable piece.

He wanted to go flying.

So, I went out to the airplane,

took him flying.

I took him flying up in the mountains

and flew him around the Expo.

And then the next day

we went to Expo and he walked around,

and I figured it was safe

because it was a lot of people

and nobody in Canada

would know who he was.

I began to think, you know,

"harboring a fugitive,"

but I didn't really know

what the consequences were.

We had immediately let Seattle know

because of his brother being in Vancouver.

So, we immediately let Seattle know

and I remember, for a fact, Seattle

We specifically asked them to, uh

at port of entries or anything else

to provide the photographs

in case he went

back and forth and they'd spot him.

It's not like it is now.

Now everything is computerized.

And it's very easy

to spot somebody coming in and out.

Back then it wasn't.

Thirty-five years ago, it was not.

Nobody ever contacted me. Nobody.

None of the police officers in Ohio.

Nobody in Washington state.

Nobody ever contacted me.

I was certain they knew who I was.

I kept a journal of all of this.

Day by day, all of my conversations,

in many cases, even recorded

conversations with my brother.

I was terribly nervous.

As a matter of fact,

when I left him in Bellingham,

I I called Gary Schweickart.

That didn't go well at all.

He said, "Everybody here in Ohio's

upset with Billy right now."

"He has really

messed this up for himself."

And he said, "Listen,

he could just walk out in the woods

and commit suicide and get it over with

and save us all a lot of problems."

I hung up the phone and went,

"I can't believe this."

This is a person that was his defender.

I I was beside myself.

I didn't know what to do.

I called Jim Murray.

And from that point on,

Jim Murray and I

almost had a daily correspondence

either by phone, mail, whatever.

At some point, his brother was worried

because of these disturbing paintings

that Billy had dropped off.

Also, all this stuff

that he had suddenly acquired

um, with with no money.

And he knew right away

that Billy needed help,

psychological help,

that he was coming apart.

I think Jim felt a sense

that perhaps he could help

get Billy situated into a new life.

Whereas we haven't been able

to do that here in central Ohio.

But he didn't know Billy well enough

to really know how to help Billy.

He didn't he didn't know Billy.

October 31st.

I'd become very very nervous then.

I called Jim Murray

and we had an hour-long discussion

about Billy's condition.

Well, I think he's probably

out now handling his money situation

He gets panicky when he gets left

with a couple of thousand dollars.

He does.

And so, if he's down

to a few hundred dollars

he is desperate, in his mind.

He's falling apart really quick.

I do have some phone calls later

where I ask Billy,

I said, "Are you losing time?"

And he said, "Yeah, a little."

Which means a lot, probably.

Then things started to break down.

There came a time that he told me

that, um, there was a guy

in his apartment complex

that went missing.

Because of that, he said,

you know, there's a lot

of police activity around there.

He needs to move.

"Too many police are gonna ask questions.

I'm gonna get discovered."

"They'll know who I am."

And I said, "Why didn't you talk

to me about this? We could've figured"

"I can make decisions for myself."

And it started getting kind of chaotic.

Before he even left Bellingham,

I knew that his brother was scared

of what Billy could have done.

Next thing I know,

he's staying at this house.

He's sharing it,

the house, with some people.

And now, he's part of a company

that he and two guys started

that's a hot tub company.

"How you doing this with these guys?"

He goes, "I'm their marketing manager."

So, he knew that he needed help

and his brother knew he needed help.

So, I was able to do

three-way conference calls,

and I could call Dr. Caul

on the other line

and push a button

and we all three could talk.

I care about Billy.

I've been worried about him

ever since he left.

Now, the best solution of all for Billy

is for him to agree to turn himself in

in the town where Dr. Allison is.

And he recommended

a doctor named Ralph Allison

who was down in California,

a well-known therapist

for multiple personality.

The only thing is, Billy has mostly,

throughout our relationship,

tried to insist

that the treatment go along his lines

and not the therapist's.

Yeah.

And my advice is that Billy,

if he won't try

to get Dr. Allison to treat him

with no deals, no strings,

I suggest you back off

and leave him to God.

I called Dr. Allison and asked

if he'd be willing to see my brother.

And he said, "If he'll come

and see me, I will see him."

Billy called me and said

he was north of Sacramento

and wanted me

to mail him some, um, marijuana,

which I had access to.

- Hello? Hi.

- Jim?

Hi, how's it going?

Not bad. How are you?

Uh, pretty good.

I just wanted to know

if you sent that to that number

that you got straightened out.

Yeah, I straightened it out, I think.

- Okay.

- I mean, I hope I straightened it out.

It was the same place we had

talked about at some point.

Yeah.

It was a place you had

already mentioned once before, right?

Okay.

Okay, because

I checked today and it was just, you know

Being a friend

of Billy Milligan's

constantly puts you

in a stressful situation.

I had promised Booker,

the highway patrol, and other people,

that I would let them know

if I knew where Billy was.

So, should I send him this medicine?

But I decided it would be the worst thing

for him not to have medicine

and to fall apart

and then somebody tries to arrest him

and then violence occurs.

So, my feeling was

to send him the medicine,

not tell anyone

and hope that he got

to see Ralph Allison a few days later.

It turns out that the address

was inside of a state prison.

And then he called me up that night

and he was really upset.

He goes, "You set me up."

"You tried to get me

to walk into a prison."

I said, "I did not try

to get you to walk into a prison."

"I don't know where he is.

You have his phone number."

"You were supposed to call him. Did you?"

"No."

So, Billy had no intention

of going inside of a prison

to meet Dr. Allison.

I said, "Where are you at now?"

He says, "Well, I'm in Florida."

He says,

"I've contacted Aunt Jo."

And I said, "Are you kidding me?

You're in Florida and

you're calling people that you know?

Are you trying to get caught?"

He says, "In many ways,

I'm already caught."

"I am in a hotel conference room."

"There is a law enforcement

convention going on."

"All the state prosecutors

are having a convention here."

And I went,

"Are you reaching out to Randy?"

He says,

"I'll tell you what I'm gonna do."

"I'm going to go

sit down in the cafeteria

and I'm going

to have the upper hand on them."

And I said, "Billy, are you serious?"

And he said, "Yes."

He called Randy Dana

the night before

he left for the convention,

and so, he put out

enough word that I felt that

he's just making it easy

for them to come pick him up.

I called the FBI.

And I said to them,

"This is going to sound bizarre

because it is bizarre."

"There's a gentleman

by the name of Billy Milligan

who's been on the lam since July

from a mental institution in Ohio."

"I've had some interaction with him

over a period of time

and I know that

he's in Florida right now."

Well, I was sitting in the office

in mid-November of 1986

and I got a phone call

from the Royal Canadian Mounted Police,

which was unusual.

I got a direct phone call.

The second they called,

I knew something was up.

And this one corporal said,

"We know where Billy is."

Billy was currently

down in Miami with his aunt,

that he had been residing

in Bellingham, Washington

under a certain name.

A couple hours later,

I get a phone call from FBI Miami,

and they're laughing.

I said, "What happened? What's so funny?"

He said,

"Well, we're sitting at his aunt's house

and his aunt is being cooperative

and says, 'Yeah, he's in town.'

And the phone rings and it's Billy."

"And Billy says,

'Hey, I'm down at the so-and-so Hotel

and I'll be home in a bit.'"

I don't know

what his condition is at this point.

I don't know if he's armed.

I would hope he's not,

but he told me

he would never be taken back alive.

He didn't want to surrender.

Well, the agents

went down to the hotel, walk in,

and there Mr. Milligan is sitting

with State Public Defender, Randall Dana.

As we arrested Billy,

Billy stood up and pointed at Dana

and Dana said,

"It wasn't me, Billy. It wasn't me."

"Don't say anything. Don't say anything."

That was big news. Again, Billy Milligan,

nine years after his arrest,

make headlines again.

Anytime I'm not

at the hospital, I'm accused of crimes.

I didn't

I didn't steal anybody's jewelry.

I didn't smuggle no dope,

and I didn't k*ll nobody,

and I didn't r*pe nobody,

and I didn't hurt anybody.

But subsequent to that,

talking to the agents in Seattle,

I found out about a man missing,

Michael Pierce Madden.

The only other thing

that happened in that whole time

was at one point in time

after Billy had left,

I had a knock on my door

and it was the RCMP.

That's the federal police agency

in Canada.

They said, "We believe

you've had some interaction with him

over the past few months."

And I said, "What's the problem here?"

And they said, "We believe that

your brother has done something harmful

to Mike Madden and he is now missing."

Michael Madden

was reported as a missing person.

This would have been in September of 1986.

That was the start of him

being in Bellingham.

Michael Madden was

in his early 30s when he disappeared.

Michael Madden's father reported

that he hadn't seen his son for some time.

He made a report to the Bellingham

Police Department on September 27th.

So, they went out immediately

and went to the apartment

and talked to friends

and talked to people that knew him.

Uh, they talked to an individual who

identified himself as Christopher Carr.

They talked to neighbors.

They talked to the landlord,

a woman who was the landlord

of the apartment that he was staying in.

And the landlady said she had last

seen Michael Madden on September 15th.

She came there to collect the rent

from the two of them

and she saw both of them

outside the apartment complex.

And they seemed to be arguing.

Every time Milligan would say something,

Michael Madden would question him.

He didn't believe what he was saying.

And finally, Milligan got mad

and, uh, went inside his apartment.

And that's the last time anybody

had ever reported seeing Michael Madden.

The girl that went and cleaned

Chris Carr's apartment,

found Mike Madden's checkbook,

bank statements

and personal things like that.

You know, his check register

under Chris Carr's bed.

What did we know about Christopher Carr?

Basically nothing.

He was new to the area.

Uh, he was not employed that we knew of.

Detective Ziebell got to interview him.

I knocked on the door at 901,

where Christopher Carr was living

and nobody answered the door.

And then pretty soon,

I heard a noise behind me

and this voice said, "Can I help you?"

And it was Billy Milligan,

also known as Christopher Carr.

I told him I needed to talk to him

about the disappearance of Michael Madden

and he said, "I gotta go."

He said, "I have to go on a business deal

and I'll be gone for three days.

I'll call you when I get back."

And so, he, as time went on,

certainly became

the focus of the investigation,

uh, and it was believed that he

may have done something to Michael Madden.

Mike Madden was receiving a check

for disability from the armed services.

And so these checks,

we discovered, were forged

and actually put into

a joint account that Mr. Carr,

Billy Milligan, had opened up

a joint account with Mr. Madden.

So, he pretty well had control over him.

And I think that when Michael Madden

came back from vacation

on the 14th of September

and then he was observed by the landlady

on the 15th of September,

they were arguing.

And I can just about bet

what they were arguing about.

It's that Madden all of sudden realizes,

"Hey, where's my government check?"

And I think that's

probably what precipitated

Christopher Carr's

decision to get rid of him.

If he'd just k*lled somebody,

why would he stay around?

Unless he wanted

to wait for the next check.

Christopher Carr also, on September 18th,

three days

after Michael Madden was last seen,

cashed Michael Madden's

September government check.

I think Christopher Carr

was pretty well the boss

in that relationship.

And Michael Madden

was the more subdued person.

This is exactly like Billy.

It was Billy's MO

to hook up with someone like that.

That that he could take a leadership role

and a protector role and

and use them.

There was some of

the sociopathic-like behavior there

where he kind of viewed people as,

"What can I get from this person?"

Billy, uh, told me once

that he was a sociopath,

a narcissistic sociopath.

I think that's probably true.

Billy was as friendly and affable

and charismatic as he was,

Billy seemed to have

no feelings for any other person.

So, even though it was probably stupid

for him to k*ll someone

and then stay there

and spend the money

and drive the car and all that,

that alter may not

have been thinking that way.

Milligan's basically setting up

a post office box in his name,

collecting and cashing Madden's

Social Security checks.

Milligan's selling his car.

That's a pretty good indicator

that he did away with him.

Billy was falling apart.

So, it's hard to know from here

what was happening inside of his head

and how desperate he was,

because each personality

needed to do what they wanted to do

and have their own life.

We always

have to look through that prism,

that context of the strong possibility

that he was a multiple.

I believe it.

Tommy could have been driving the car.

Danny could have been driving the car.

Who drove the car?

If he was as smart as people say he was,

to pull the world's biggest hoax,

he wouldn't make that stupid mistake.

The man who

called himself Christopher Carr

said he worked here

at Western Washington University.

What he said he did here

changed all the time.

Sometimes he claimed to be a professor

of Computer Sciences.

Other times,

he said he was a professor of Art.

People here who knew him said,

for him, lying was a way of life.

I discovered that Christopher Carr

was really Billy Milligan

when FBI Agent Cochran

had a flyer

with Billy Milligan's face on it,

showing that he was Christopher Carr

and then they called me

and told me about that.

We started checking in

to try to find out how he got his ID,

where he was from.

We went to Billy Milligan's cousin's place

and he advised us

that Milligan and a friend

had stayed there for a couple days

and Milligan was not there at this time.

He said Milligan

did leave his personal property

in his cousin's house,

a couple suitcases and some boxes.

Sometimes we know

that people will keep things

because they're sort of, uh

It reminds them

and they're trophies, you know.

And whether that had

anything to do here, I don't know,

but I've seen that in some of my cases.

And sometimes that occurs with homicides.

There was a fishing tackle box

that I opened up.

It was full of paint supplies.

Another box was looked through,

it had some gold jewelry.

And in that box, we found two lenses

that seemed to match

the particular frames.

And there were specks

of what appeared to be blood

on the lenses and also on the frame.

And this was pre-DNA days. We had

DNA, really, we started using in 1989,

but we did not have DNA at that point.

The only thing we had

was blood on the glasses

and it still would not

give us enough answers.

We found no evidence where pathologists

could say that

there was enough blood there

that the person is dead.

We had nothing to show

that anybody had passed away.

Well, we had a strong belief

that Mr. Madden was k*lled.

And we believe that Mr. Milligan

was extremely involved in it,

but we really did not

have sufficient evidence

nor sufficient answers to those elements

that I would have to prove,

uh, to actually bring a case.

They don't have a body.

You can assume.

It's a good circumstantial case,

but they didn't have enough.

Today, police are

looking into Milligan's role

in the disappearance of Mike Madden.

We don't have any body.

We don't have any criminal

or any evidence of a crime

having been committed.

Again, it's a very suspicious

set of circumstances.

I certainly could have.

I could have charged him

with forgery and theft,

and he'd probably

serve 30 to 60 days in jail,

because that would be

the sentence for that type of a theft.

And then he might end up living here

which would have been

the worst of all worlds for us.

Someone that can do these things

and really not be held back

by any feelings of empathy

or feelings that

you're doing something wrong.

And which makes these people

the most dangerous people we deal with.

This case is frustrating to all of us,

mostly because I had to

keep talking with Michael Madden's father.

And he would always ask us,

"Is there anything new?

Is there anything new?"

And he always felt

that Milligan had k*lled his son.

I would love to believe

that he did not k*ll him.

I cannot say he did not k*ll him.

He was desperate for money.

He was desperate for medication.

He knew he needed treatment.

He was falling apart.

It was a completely different

Billy Milligan

than the one I left in Colorado.

So, I think he k*lled Mike Madden.

He may not remember it.

Yes. I think he could have.

I think there's

a strong possibility he could have.

He had gone to a party

of 300-and-some people,

someplace down on the lake.

And the entire weekend,

I was not able to get a hold of him,

do not know where he was at.

Never ever could tell me where he was at.

From what I understand from the police,

that's the weekend they think

Mike Madden went missing.

So, I don't know what happened.

And then Jim told me that, um,

Billy gave him back

all of his diving equipment

and everything except a weight belt.

He probably dumped the body in a lake.

In the state of Washington,

as most states,

unless you have a body,

you don't really have a m*rder.

Billy Milligan may yet be

going to the state of Washington

to face m*rder charges,

but for now, at least,

he'll soon be on his way

from Florida back to Columbus.

Mr. Milligan.

I waive.

He waives.

No bond.

And a waiver.

So, he waived extradition

and Milligan will be

brought back to Columbus within ten days.

Billy Milligan was

arrested in November of '86,

about four months after he escaped.

He was brought back to Columbus, Ohio

and Billy Milligan was incarcerated

at the Timothy Moritz Forensic Center.

Once Billy was

put back under the care of Dr. Lindner,

he just gave up.

Go back to jail and rot.

That's what I figured I was doing anyway.

Are you going to eat?

Probably not.

I mean, what have I got to live for?

What have I got to look forward to?

Every time I come back in this courtroom,

the judge is going to say,

"Well, you committed crimes 10 years ago,

so you're dangerous to society."

So, I think

that the hunger strike

was a way to get attention,

maybe media attention as well,

and also to just feel in control.

It was around day 34, if I recall,

he ended the hunger strike.

Um, so close to death, he was

I didn't think he was

going to make it through that one.

The hospital brought in

another doctor, Dr. Porter.

After seeing him for a period of time

at the Timothy B. Moritz Forensic Center,

I had his attorneys

petition the court for his release.

So, there was a court hearing

where his attorneys petitioned

to have him released

from the Forensic Center

to continue treatment

on an outpatient basis.

And the judge at that time

wanted an outside evaluation,

an outside expert.

He was taken to Boston

to be admitted into

Dr. Chu's unit in McLean Hospital.

Dr. Chu wanted him on his unit for a week

so that he could

observe him day in and day out.

Billy was cooperative.

He was interested

in having this evaluation,

but he also very strongly

wanted to give me the impression

that he was stable

and, in a very subtle way,

I felt slightly manipulated by him.

My sense was that

since he had rather stably fused

and was no longer dissociative,

he was not likely

to be particularly dangerous to others.

Dr. Chu concluded

that he could be released.

I just want

to be normal and like anybody else

and live a normal life,

but I got a lot more to prove

than the average person now.

He didn't feel that he in any way

could live a normal life here

with the publicity

that had followed him for 20 years.

At first, the Department of Corrections

gave him a job, actually,

doing computer programming.

I think that was a 90-day contract

to help him make a transition.

I even clipped the article

and sent it to the Bureau in 1988

where they gave him responsibility

with some type

of computer systems in Ohio,

which I thought was outrageous. And

So, here we have a guy

that led us on a wild goose chase,

possibly k*lled an individual,

and it's all forgotten.

And there Billy is, back again.

And that that aggravated me.

But they didn't tell me

that it was going to be like this.

They didn't tell me that,

"Now that you're so famous,

no one's gonna want

anything to do with you.

No one's going to care about you

because you were branded."

In people buying into

his multiple personality story,

true or not, people do forget the victims.

There were at least

four young women that were r*ped.

And Mr. Madden, who is

I believe he k*lled him.

People, they forget about it.

They

The the idea that he was

a multiple personality individual

trumps it all.

It's over everything.

March of 1990,

I received a call from Tracy,

Billy Milligan's girlfriend,

and she was having trouble with Milligan.

He had threatened to k*ll her.

And Tracy called me

and she was scared to death

and I said, "What's going on?"

She said, "Billy's threatened to k*ll me."

"Will you come up and spend the night?"

I said, "Absolutely."

So, I drove to Columbus,

and about two o'clock

in the morning, Billy called her.

And, you know, I didn't answer the phone.

I didn't say anything.

I was just listening.

He said, "I know Rob's there.

Let me talk to him."

"You realize that I can

come over there and k*ll all of you

and there's nothing they can

do about it because I'm mentally ill."

But the most significant thing

that Billy Milligan told Tracy was,

"Those cops

were so stupid and incompetent,

they didn't realize that

when I was in Florida and arrested

that I had

Michael Madden's glasses with me

and there were specks

of Michael Madden's blood

on those glasses."

And he also told Tracy that

he had k*lled a Black man in Logan, Ohio.

And that was a particularly brutal m*rder.

One weekend,

Dwaun Cox's mother came to my house

and she started asking me

about her missing son,

and she told me his name was Dwaun

and he hadn't come home

a couple nights ago.

And they were concerned

because that wasn't like him,

and they found his car

abandoned in the Logan area.

I asked Billy if he knew Dwaun

and he said, "Yeah, I knew Dwaun."

And I said,

"Do you know that he's missing?"

He said,

"Well, we ran around Old Man's Cave

and we smoked some pot and stuff,

but I really don't know."

And I don't remember

if it was before that or after that,

Billy came riding up on a motorcycle.

And Kathy and I looked at him

and said, "Where did you get that?"

He goes, "Oh, I bought it."

And he gave Kathy a large amount of money.

I have no idea how much it was,

but it was a substantial amount of money.

When I heard about this young man

being m*rder*d,

or not

disappearing,

it kind of made me wonder

if maybe that's where he got the money.

And I don't think

that he's ever been found.

I don't know if he

I don't I don't know.

How much control does this person have?

What's really being manifest here?

Most psychiatrists,

psychologists, social workers,

have not, uh, seen such a person.

Some doctors even doubt

that the illness exists

as a separate disorder.

Don't call me Mr. Milligan anymore.

Didn't I tell you that once?

Billy Milligan's answer

to all the crimes he could commit

is to say, "It wasn't me who did that."

It makes things more confusing

to say, "It's not me, it's the others."

He got off from going to jail

with this stupid excuse

about multiple personality disorder.

Nobody knows about

multiple personalities, quite frankly.

People don't even agree if they exist.

I believe that at that time,

psychiatrists were in such awe

that we put a label on him

of 24 personalities

because he was a master manipulator

and, in the end, it makes us

talk more about him than the real victims.

He didn't learn different ways

of dealing with people

because his fundamental

underlying character

was this really self-centered, impulsive,

narcissistic, acting-out individual

who didn't care about other people.

All of it was about Billy

and what Billy wanted.

Here, we enter into a perverse logic

of someone who has no empathy.

The other doesn't exist for Milligan.

Is he a danger?

Yeah, I think he was a dangerous person.

But that's just the nature

of what I think he was.

That is true psychosis.

Psychopathy is this moment when a person

is capable of doing something

while feeling absolutely nothing.

Thus, they will act very badly.

But his sense of perverse pleasure

is beyond his control

and he can't stop himself.

I think that Dr. Brown's

1970 diagnosis was fair enough.

We are dealing with

a fairly serious hysterical neurosis,

with features

that might be called antisocial.

It was very hard for me

because of who I was.

I've always been controversy.

Who is the real Billy Milligan?

Which one is the real personality?

Billy himself was probably

a very, very, very intelligent human being

from the beginning.

Only a certain kind of person

can become a multiple personality.

He should have an Academy Award.

- For what?

- For the performance he's put on.

Is it a hoax? Has he been faking it?

I don't think that society

has given him a chance

to even begin to get well.

Nobody said why these people are here.

One of the things

that a multiple personality does

is to conceal the fact

that there are multiple personalities.

When I saw Billy Milligan,

he knew nothing about Ragen,

Allen, Tommy, David and so on.

Connie Wilbur was a pioneer.

She was out there fighting

and defending this diagnosis,

trying to convince people

about this diagnosis.

Is that Is that the people that

that lady told me was inside me?

How should we

account for Billy Milligan?

Was he, um, someone

faking multiple personality disorder?

He was good in his previous crimes

at making up excuses.

He used the mental health system

and the diagnosis popular at the time

and the gullibility of his therapists,

and I don't see anything in his life

that would say that

he should be considered mentally ill,

should be given

the privileges of a sick role.

He's acting like a very ambivalent,

indecisive, contradictory person.

You're dealing

with somebody who's been traumatized,

who's learned to exist in a world

where people are a*usive

and they become manipulative

because it's a survival skill.

It is a defense, of course,

against intolerable situations.

Why am I that way?

Multiple personality had this brief,

amazing epidemic spread in America

occurring around this time in the mid-70s.

It becomes a kind of mass hysteria.

So you have to be very careful

with them not to suggest things.

There is a hardcore skeptic group

who doesn't believe in this diagnosis,

who sees it as either, um,

malingering or faking, acting

And for the multiple,

that they have a good therapist

that knows what they're doing

and doesn't say, "This is a fakey thing,"

or, "They're trying to manipulate people,"

or "I don't believe in this condition."

Which these kinds of attitudes and ideas

are all over the place

and it's a shame

because these are brilliant people.

And we're losing a lot of brains

and ability when we lose the multiples.

The whole multiple

personality thing was a bit excessive.

They preferred to refocus everything

on Dissociation Identity Disorder.

We should realize

that multiple personality

died in the mid-90s.

If this was really

a deeply ingrained part of human nature,

it wouldn't disappear that quickly.

It's a creation of charismatic therapists

and imaginative, suggestive patients

to create these epidemics.

We can see how the symptoms

and the diagnosis are also induced

by the way in which

doctors and psychologists

take care of these patients.

And I think that the Billy Milligan case,

like the Sibyl case or others,

is like saying the moon

is made of green cheese,

and believing that the state

of having multiple personalities

is having real people

that haunt the body of an individual.

¸People formed opinions

about him based on the assumption

that he didn't have problems

and and he does.

But he became so involved

in his own story, I think,

that his life became

living all those roles.

Milligan's problem is that even people

who believe in rehabilitation

become uneasy when someone like Billy

is released in the neighborhood.

No matter what the doctors say,

many here are convinced

that he's dangerous.

We're faced with chameleons,

we're faced with people who are capable

of metamorphosing their state of mind

depending on their needs or situation.

And we can obviously see

the interest of the press and the media.

This duality is really

the Hollywood style, par excellence.

The Minds of Billy Milligan,

it is a fascinating book.

Some people wanted to

explore Billy's case to make a movie

because that's what was hot at the time.

The life of Billy Milligan

contained all the elements

that Hollywood craves.

The story of his life

became a cause célèbre.

It was

it was what they call a "hot property."

According

to Entertainment Weekly,

Leonardo DiCaprio

is set to play Billy Milligan

in a true story film

about a man with 24 personalities.

You have the aspects

of psychology and schizophrenia.

This is high drama that Hollywood adores.

He was living in Heliard at the time,

um, and he told me that James Cameron

was interested in making a movie

and that he was talking

with people out in California.

James Cameron had

interacted with Billy Milligan.

Uh, he actually went with Milligan to Ohio

because he wanted to see and witness

where the alleged

r*pe and crimes were committed.

After Billy Milligan and James Cameron

agreed to make the story

of his life together,

Billy Milligan was

brought out to Los Angeles

by the studios.

When I went to California to visit Billy,

he was definitely high rolling, um,

you know, the LA lifestyle, I guess.

All the weed

and anything you could want was available

and took us out to dinner,

fancy restaurants

And took us out to dinner,

fancy restaurants,

and throwing money around like crazy.

Billy Milligan really was

given the Hollywood treatment.

He was put up in hotels

with swimming pools.

There were nights out,

uh, with drugs and alcohol.

Yes, there was

a lot of marijuana, a lot of cocaine.

He had a condo. We'd end up back at that

and try to get girls

to come back to the hot tub.

And my friends and their girlfriends

and we'd all hang out.

It was pretty interesting.

Billy did have a taste

of the Hollywood lifestyle

and, um, I'm sure

he found it fascinating and exciting.

Going on some motorcycle rides

with some celebrities that he had met.

He'd met Arnold Schwarzenegger

and Danny DeVito

but it's very temporal.

When James Cameron

started pursuing the story,

the life story of Billy Milligan,

he found out

that a woman named Sandy Arcara

apparently owned the rights

to Billy Milligan's life story.

The Minds of Billy Milligan.

Billy might have offered the rights

to his story to numerous people.

I didn't know about it and the same

contract that I have with him,

I was supposed to get

all the royalties from that book.

Uh, in the contract,

it stated that I would get,

I think it was 75% of the royalties

from the first book

and 100% of the royalties

from the second book

if a second book was ever made,

and royalties

from any movies that would be made.

Billy Milligan may have given the rights

to his life story to countless people.

You know, he did have

multiple personalities after all.

At this stage, Sandy Arcara said,

"Well, hang on.

He gave you the rights to this story

for a lot less than should be granted."

And so, she sued James Cameron

to increase her salary from $250,000

to 1.5 million dollars.

And James Cameron took that to Fox.

Fox said no.

James Cameron said,

"Sandy, sorry, see you later,"

and the project collapsed.

Also, at the same time,

the state was hounding him

for money, for paying back.

Ohio was billing him

for every day he had ever spent

in a mental health facility

or hospital or prison in Ohio.

And Lavelle, which was Allan Goldsberry,

the original attorney, back in '78,

um, his law firm sued him for, um

geez, it was close to $100,000.

He had no money,

so he, uh, declared bankruptcy.

But the William Morris Agency

was starting to receive

large sums of royalties

from sales of the books overseas.

Couple, three million dollars

or thereabouts,

and they became aware

of competing claims to that money,

mostly by the state of Ohio.

So, again people were envious.

They were jealous.

They didn't like the idea that this guy

is getting away with something

and he's also making money.

They actually passed a law

called the Milligan Law

because they didn't like the idea

that he had made money

from selling his book.

So, that bankruptcy court

ultimately took jurisdiction

and would receive the book royalties

and pay the state of Ohio

and pay the other creditors.

So, he was living in LA at the time

and he moved to Las Vegas.

Las Vegas is a city

of gambling and drinking and partying

and he could win.

And I was like, "Why don't we go pay

a year's worth of your rent so you never"

"Nope, that is not what

gambling's about," he would say.

When we were kids,

Billy was just always the fun uncle,

so he was always really full of life.

Wanted to spoil us all the time.

Wanted to give us tons of stuff.

He would tell me about certain games

where he won like $10,000, $20,000,

playing different games

with blackjack and stuff.

He was okay there for a good long while

until he had episodes of mental decline.

He would get very agitated

and belligerent and threaten people.

He's always threatening people.

I'll sue you, or I'll k*ll you,

or I'll have you k*lled.

So, he was arrested a couple times

for misdemeanors

or for these kinds of things.

He was so totally broken

and so totally crushed

that he called me and said,

"Can I come back to Ohio?"

I bought a mobile home out in the field

where he could quietly paint

and just live a very quiet life.

He was diagnosed in 2012 with cancer.

He was very scared.

He was still drinking very heavily.

He couldn't really care for himself.

Towards the end of his life,

I was more of a caretaker

and he had called me

to come visit him at the facility.

So, I came, and he was asking me,

"Do you think that God

could ever forgive me

for the things that I've done in my life?"

And so, I tell him, "Of course,

I think God can forgive you

for anything that you've done."

And he says,

"I've been a terrible person,"

and, like,

"You don't even know what I've done."

I say, "I think God can forgive

whatever it is that you've done."

And then he told me,

"Well, I've k*lled people."

"Can he even forgive me for that?"

I do things and don't remember them

because I'm asleep.

And people tell me I do things

bad things.

How will we ever know

what is real in this case?

I've never met

anybody as extraordinary,

or as smart,

or as fun to be around

as Billy Milligan was.

He had some charms.

He had some creative ability.

He was very creative.

He was the most creative criminal.

Certainly a sociopath.

Billy Milligan was very manipulative.

- Billy was

- Interesting.

Talented

- Extremely intelligent

- Unusual.

He was a very persuasive person.

He was very much in control.

Dangerous.

Fragile.

Damaged.

Is he a con man?

He seemed to be a very intelligent person.

Bright con man.

He was desperate

desperately crying for help at all times

and I don't think he knew

how to ask for that help.

Who is he?

He's he was a brilliant artist

that was insane all his life.

Billy was Billy.

What about the victims? What about them?

The victims

were forgotten in all this.

I never, ever excuse,

even with a mental illness, that issue.

I felt upset that I didn't

say something and go to the police.

Then Chalmer wouldn't have

got away with saying he didn't do anything

when I know

he had to have done something to him.

So

In the morning ♪

I want blood ♪

In the evening ♪

I want blood ♪

The devil inside me ♪

I need blood ♪

It's all right, I need blood ♪

Feel all right ♪

I want blood

I want blood ♪

It's all right, I need blood ♪